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 Post subject: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 4:45 am 
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Hello Everyone.

For about 2 months or so now, I have been on a survival high. Researching everything I possibly can to survive, whether it be how to build a shelter correctly and what to store in it. All that is simple knowledge if you really take the time to think about it.

Other than the 2 necessities of food and water, you will not survive without Oxygen. Now lets say it is a solar flare that wipes us out - wouldn't that deplete our oxygen supply outside of our shelters? Now, I know about the air filters you can buy for a few hundred to a few thousand dollars that will suck the air into your bunker from the outside filtering things such as radiation and other toxins providing fresh breathable air inside. But, if there is no oxygen outside of your shelter, what can you do to supply a large amount of fresh oxygen to keep yourself and family alive for as long as it takes for the earth to replenish itself. (they do it on the ISS or International Space Station - but for all I know, it may be provided to them via oxygen tanks)

Anyone have any ideas? I would love to hear about them.

I believe I have heard something about boiling water or bubbling water to produce it but personally don't think that would be enough for a large room.

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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 6:53 am 
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Oxygen can NOT be produced by boiling water. Whoever told you that was a moron. You can produce oxygen (and hydrogen) from water by electrolysis. You can google that and read up on the efficacy of it all. Go back to your high school chemeistry books and you will find lost of ways to create oxygen out of compounds that have them. You can have plants, you can pass carbon dioxide rich air thru rebreathers and get more oxygen.

The thing is that if all the air you have is in the container you put yourself in, what would be the point? There will be no way for you to re-oxygenate the planet on your own using just the stuff you have in your survival container. You are talking Terra-forming and even with hundreds of fusion reactors, it would take decades to re-oxygenate the earth.

If what you describe can come true, the best place to be in is a nuclear submarine. Even then six months into the catastrophy, you will have to think about which of your mates you have to kill to eat.

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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 5:23 pm 
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XSlayerALE wrote:
Oxygen can NOT be produced by boiling water. Whoever told you that was a moron.


That's exactly what I thought. LOL Not sure where I read that but it was on some other website about 2012. Another example of not to believe everything you read. The idea of it made me think of a fish tank and how oxygen is supplied by the bubbles. Either way, even if it were possible, still don't think it would supply enough oxygen to survive.

I have always known about plants supplying oxygen, but there again, you would need a huge area just for multiple plants to do so (I think). I watched a program on Discovery or some other learning channel that said something about all the trees in Central Park supply enough oxygen for 30,000 people. Please don't quote me on that - I haven't seen that program in a long time, so I could be off on the statistics. I do however plan to grow vegetables within the shelter and that should supply some oxygen needed.

The thing I do like about the technology of today is almost everything you need to survive in a shelter exists somewhere. Like the Aero Garden (http://www.aerogrow.com/index.php) The perfect artificial lighted garden. As well as the many other great things out there. Like the website for long lasting canned food - (http://www.beprepared.com) Another source of survival.

I guess as far as the idea of no oxygen left above, it would probably be a wise idea to store some SPECIAL pills that would put you to sleep peacefully. The only problem with that is "I can't except it" The idea of ending my life just isn't a possibility for me. I have been preparing for a day like this since I was like 12 years old. In my eyes, there is always another way out. Whether it be one situation or another. There's always a way to survive. The human race will live on. And if it don't, well then that really sucks.

Lately I have been thinking of a way to store all of our knowledge, pictures of everything around us, our accomplishments and downfalls, etc. etc. etc. and send it up in space in a capsule of some sort and release it in the direction of another star system. All for the sole fact that if humanity is wiped from the face of the earth, our legacy will go on. Even if it is just within electronic files. Maybe everything we learned can help another race out there struggling to get by like we are.
(I know I know, many things could go wrong. The capsule could crash into something or be destroyed in some way or a species that would find it may not be intelligent enough to decipher it. The list can go on and on but isn't it worth trying.

Either way, I like many of you out there that have been preparing already, will do what I can to survive. Hopefully when it's over, we can all sit back and throw a party as the last members of the Human Race.

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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2009 9:11 pm 
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I'm new to this whole thing so I will definitely say something wrong. But if you're in a nuclear sub and you're managing to create your own oxygen, then couldn't you also exit the sub to gather food?

If this is a bad move, please tell me why.


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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2009 11:43 pm 
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well if there is no air in the world and you happen to be on a sub and making your own air then what food would you be able to find when you stepped out most food sources would be dead and rotting wouldn't you think. not to say that if there was no air then there might not be any water as well??? hummmm??? what say you.

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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2009 11:53 pm 
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I assumed that the creatures in the ocean would survive. I'm confused then. If even ocean life is dead, then there's no point in trying to survive. Maybe there is one emotionally, but not logically.


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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2009 12:24 am 
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Plants.


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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2009 2:40 am 
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Well, lets see. What got me started on this topic is the fact that if we do get struck by a solar flare and the earth becomes a fire ball from everything burning above ground and as it burns - it's sucking up the oxygen as well in return depleting it. Our chances for survival would most likely be slim to none - I would say. (I don't pretend to know the answers but can only imagine that would be the final outcome)

But if you look at it in NASA terms, they can put man on Mars which I believe has minimal oxygen (or should I say not enough for a human being to live) or the moon for that fact which has no oxygen and can create their own to sustain life. What's to say we couldn't (which I'm sure gov's. all over the world have done or are doing already) dig a hole in the ground and create an airtight city for the survivors to live as long as it takes for the earth to fix itself. Sort of like a CITY OF EMBER.

Now I'm sure this planet of ours has gone through this same situation before and as evolution has taught us, life has gone on. THIS WHOLE THING IS MORE CONFUSING then anything one can imagine because we just wont know till the scenario presents itself.

Now again, I'm all for living as long as I possibly can and are looking for ways to make that happen. Man I wish I was a millionaire so I can build the ultimate bunker and bring all of you with me on the ultimate journey of a lifetime.

The future of mankind may very well be underground. At least for the next 1000 years or so.

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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2009 3:00 am 
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Your doomsday scenario has two ideas that seem to cancel out. If a solar flare or something like it scorches our planet to the point of using up all of the planet's oxygen, there will be nowhere to hide. Even deep bunkers under mountains will be reduced to cinders. The oceans would boil and submarines would become metal "hotpockets".

If it's not powerful enough to start a global firestorm, then the oxygen within our atmosphere will not drop low enough to suffocate the remaining life. If a good portion of plant life survives, oxygen levels will fluctuate, but not drop to zero.

Anything that may cause the oxygen levels to drop that low will kill us off long before we can worry about it.

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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 4:40 pm 
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A solar flare huh? Sounds like that recent-ish movie starring nicolas cage. Y'know, and the aliens take the children to a new planet? Yea. That one.
BeliefMakr wrote:
The oceans would boil and submarines would become metal "hotpockets".

There are rockets and out space travel equipment designed for re-entry into the atmosphere... Designed to keep the interior cool, while withstanding the heat of re-entry. Something like that, maybe... But you'd have to modify it to withstand higher temparatures and for longer periods of time. Ok my nerd moment is over now.

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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 7:46 pm 
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Not so sure but our government is digging many underground bases to provide food and shelter for which who will survive 2012.

http://projectcamelot.org/norway.html

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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 8:46 pm 
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http://aem.asm.org/cgi/reprint/19/1/76.pdf

took me five mintues to find this useing google.

very good read.

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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2009 7:39 am 
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Hey IWalkAlone,

Like a couple already mentioned the fireball scenario would wipe out a lot more than oxygen and make life unsustainable. In which case living a few minutes past the blast would be a miracle... But I doubt that would happen.

Don't focus too much of your energy on systems and techniques to combat a comet or firestorm. Many solar flares have already hit the World, it has been fairly common and has caused damage. http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2008/06may_carringtonflare.htm But none of that level. The worst we would be looking at, as many speculate is the destruction of most complex electrical devices, with satelites being most susceptable on down.

Anyway make sure you have the basics first. Look at tensions abroad. As several prophecies say, this may be more than just natural phenominia, but also a series of manmade disasters that could happen much sooner than later. Be ready as much as you can be with the basics. Just my .02.

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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2009 8:36 pm 
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Thanks for finding that paper, Risen. 30kw of electricity and 2 cubic feet of algae at maximum efficiency to provide enough exchange for the O2 needs of one man.

I wonder if the energy requirements would have been a bit different if they had used an LED lamp instead of a 1500 watt incandescent bulb...?

Still, in the event that the atmosphere has burned off, we are not going to make it. There won't be a place up top to return to, and even the subterranian ecosystems we know about rely on input from the outside. It wouldn't be possible without a professional setup and miles upon miles of air-tight tunnels and free electricity for O2 production.

Then there's the question of food and water...


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 Post subject: Re: Oxygen and how to create it when there is none.....
PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2009 9:45 pm 
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Well that study was done back in the 1970's. Tech had come along way since then, so a new study useing moden equipment should be called for, and would make a great under-graduate to graduate, to masters paper on the subject.

Also according to the study 75% of our oxygen comes from algea, and moss that is just below the earths surface. So if there was a flash effect of O2 burn off, as soon as it happened, algea would go crazy reproduceing due to large scale CO2, and minerals from the fire.

Also O2 levels will be higher closer to the oceans, and thinner the higher you go up in altidude(sp).

I am wondering what would happen in a flash burn case, that melts the caps, and release the O2 that is in pockets in it? If the melting occurs after the flash point stage then they should be ok and help start replaceing the O2 back into the atmosphere.

For shit and giggles, how large of a complexe would be needed to replace the worlds O2 back up to 50% of what it is now, if burn off occured takeing it down to say 10% of current level.

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