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 Post subject: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 9:51 pm 
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There's a currently a survey running at MSNBC that asks if you think foods should require GMO labeling. Please vote YES for GMO labeling! Help to win this poll by a wide margin and help send a powerful message so we don't have to go 'Egypt' on the FDA... :wink:

http://health.newsvine.com/_question/2011/02/25/6131050-do-you-believe-genetically-modified-foods-should-be-labeled

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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 3:18 am 
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I voted yes it should be labelled. If it's GM it ain't food, it's pot luck...


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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:00 am 
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One of the comments of this report asks "Why mess with nature?" Well, we've been messing with nature ever since we found out that we could. Dogs are a good example as well as any of our most popular agricultural crops and domesticated food animals. Even messing with their genetic structure is old hat. It was started by that black guy with the peanuts. Genetic Modification is just a brand new technique. Labeling modified food is about as useless as buying organic.

Tell me what the difference is between crossbreeding different species of plants to produce a better plant (which is our current method) and genetic manipulation by combining the known good genes of two species to get a better plant? The latter is just a shortcut of the former.

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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:24 am 
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The difference is the difference between manipulation and modification. In the former you are promoting the strength of certain traits within the same species. What Bigagra is doing is taking taits from completely different species and jamming them together.

And you might say, "but surely that can't be all that bad, it might be beneficial." Alright, then why don't we also go ahead and cross turkeys, pigs, tuna, and chickens so we can make a new white meat. Surely that critter would be safe to eat! :shock:

GMOs are straight wrong and shouldn't be allowed as food products.

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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:36 am 
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At a genetic level, species are a genetic divergence from a common ancestor. Their traits are still there but merely recessed. Genetic code will not allow plant DNA to be spliced into any animal DNA, but all mammalians share some form of genetic similarities. The traits are either turn off or on. All birds have feathers but a specific shutting down of their DNA that controls feathers will produce scales (like in dinosaurs, where birds evolved from) We dont have feathers so we cannot genetically make lizard men. You can manipulate genes (by crossbreeding) to produce what we can achieve by modification except it takes years to do and a lot of error. You can not get genetically modified by eating modified food. Your digestive system is a chemical process not a genetic one. Germs, viruses and people take advantage of brand new food sources so yes, new bugs will appear for GM food, but if they havent killed us because of our crossbreeding, they wont kill us for our GM.

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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 7:33 am 
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XSlayerALE wrote:
At a genetic level, species are a genetic divergence from a common ancestor.

That's unproven - it's a theory that has yet to find solid evidence, and genetic diversity (29 million genes and 50 thousand genetic families suggest the theory has gaping holes in it.
XSlayerALE wrote:
Genetic code will not allow plant DNA to be spliced into any animal DNA

This is just plain wrong. They are splicing fish genes into fruits, and trying all kinds of animal genes into plants. There is nothing that will prevent any type of gene manipulation in the code.


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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:57 pm 
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XSlayerALE wrote:
Germs, viruses and people take advantage of brand new food sources so yes, new bugs will appear for GM food, but if they havent killed us because of our crossbreeding, they wont kill us for our GM.

Quite the opposite. If you bothered to do a little bit of research, you'd realize how dangerous this game is that the Big Ag is playing with Monsanto. Not only that labeling them is the least we can ask, they should be halted immediately alltogether. GM food killed rats in a laboratory in 3 weeks, and it will kill you too. They have known to cause digestive diseases and now, abortions. They are a threat to the ecosystem and entire food production. I recommend everyone to read the whole article below. It's downright frightening and affects everyone and everything, not only people in the US, but everywhere.
Quote:
In a shocking warning letter to USDA Secretary Tom Vilsack, a highly experienced, ex-military pathogen researcher warns that the use of Roundup via GMO crops is resulting in the emergence of a deadly new pathogen -- previously unknown to science -- that's causing widespread spontaneous abortions among cattle. The pathogen appears in high concentrations among even non-GMO crops that are "managed" through the use of glyphosate (Roundup) for weed control.
http://www.naturalnews.com/031473_GMOs_pathogens.html#ixzz1FYdslg5x

Here is the letter in its entirety. Long but very informative, and very scary.
Quote:
The letter to the USDA from Professor Huber
Dear Secretary Vilsack:

A team of senior plant and animal scientists have recently brought to my attention the discovery of an electron microscopic pathogen that appears to significantly impact the health of plants, animals, and probably human beings. Based on a review of the data, it is widespread, very serious, and is in much higher concentrations in Roundup Ready (RR) soybeans and corn -- suggesting a link with the RR gene or more likely the presence of Roundup. This organism appears NEW to science!

This is highly sensitive information that could result in a collapse of US soy and corn export markets and significant disruption of domestic food and feed supplies. On the other hand, this new organism may already be responsible for significant harm (see below). My colleagues and I are therefore moving our investigation forward with speed and discretion, and seek assistance from the USDA and other entities to identify the pathogen’s source, prevalence, implications, and remedies.

We are informing the USDA of our findings at this early stage, specifically due to your pending decision regarding approval of RR alfalfa. Naturally, if either the RR gene or Roundup itself is a promoter or co-factor of this pathogen, then such approval could be a calamity. Based on the current evidence, the only reasonable action at this time would be to delay deregulation at least until sufficient data has exonerated the RR system, if it does.

For the past 40 years, I have been a scientist in the professional and military agencies that evaluate and prepare for natural and manmade biological threats, including germ warfare and disease outbreaks. Based on this experience, I believe the threat we are facing from this pathogen is unique and of a high risk status. In layman’s terms, it should be treated as an emergency.

A diverse set of researchers working on this problem have contributed various pieces of the puzzle, which together presents the following disturbing scenario:

Unique Physical Properties

This previously unknown organism is only visible under an electron microscope (36,000X), with an approximate size range equal to a medium size virus. It is able to reproduce and appears to be a micro-fungal-like organism. If so, it would be the first such micro-fungus ever identified. There is strong evidence that this infectious agent promotes diseases of both plants and mammals, which is very rare.

Pathogen Location and Concentration

It is found in high concentrations in Roundup Ready soybean meal and corn, distillers meal, fermentation feed products, pig stomach contents, and pig and cattle placentas.

Linked with Outbreaks of Plant Disease

The organism is prolific in plants infected with two pervasive diseases that are driving down yields and farmer income -- sudden death syndrome (SDS) in soy, and Goss’ wilt in corn. The pathogen is also found in the fungal causative agent of SDS (Fusarium solani fsp glycines).

Implicated in Animal Reproductive Failure

Laboratory tests have confirmed the presence of this organism in a wide variety of livestock that have experienced spontaneous abortions and infertility. Preliminary results from ongoing research have also been able to reproduce abortions in a clinical setting.

The pathogen may explain the escalating frequency of infertility and spontaneous abortions over the past few years in US cattle, dairy, swine, and horse operations. These include recent reports of infertility rates in dairy heifers of over 20%, and spontaneous abortions in cattle as high as 45%.

For example, 450 of 1,000 pregnant heifers fed wheatlege experienced spontaneous abortions. Over the same period, another 1,000 heifers from the same herd that were raised on hay had no abortions. High concentrations of the pathogen were confirmed on the wheatlege, which likely had been under weed management using glyphosate.

Recommendations

In summary, because of the high titer of this new animal pathogen in Roundup Ready crops, and its association with plant and animal diseases that are reaching epidemic proportions, we request USDA’s participation in a multi-agency investigation, and an immediate moratorium on the deregulation of RR crops until the causal/predisposing relationship with glyphosate and/or RR plants can be ruled out as a threat to crop and animal production and human health.

It is urgent to examine whether the side-effects of glyphosate use may have facilitated the growth of this pathogen, or allowed it to cause greater harm to weakened plant and animal hosts. It is well-documented that glyphosate promotes soil pathogens and is already implicated with the increase of more than 40 plant diseases; it dismantles plant defenses by chelating vital nutrients; and it reduces the bioavailability of nutrients in feed, which in turn can cause animal disorders. To properly evaluate these factors, we request access to the relevant USDA data.

I have studied plant pathogens for more than 50 years. We are now seeing an unprecedented trend of increasing plant and animal diseases and disorders. This pathogen may be instrumental to understanding and solving this problem. It deserves immediate attention with significant resources to avoid a general collapse of our critical agricultural infrastructure.

Sincerely,

COL (Ret.) Don M. Huber
Emeritus Professor, Purdue University
APS Coordinator, USDA National Plant Disease Recovery System (NPDRS)

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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 7:41 pm 
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lirispaws11 ................ X2

And as a rancher/farmer I can tell you that most of us do NOT want this crap and I am not just referring to 'organic' farmers. Monsanto canola has already contaminated farmland everywhere. The roundup ready canola has contaminated crops everywhere and those who are trying to raise non GMO canola are screwed.

GMO corn is literally contaminating the environment and the latest potential problem from the article posted has huge implications.

GMO alfalfa, will do the same thing. Once it is out you cannot control it. It is only being approved because big business wants if for bio-fuel. The rest of us that use alfalfa for our animals DO NOT want this shit anywhere near us.

When will people learn. We do the same thing over and over. We screw with things and they have unknown consequences years later that were not thought of at the time. Now we are screwing with things genetically and there will/are problems arising already and you can bet there will be more that surface later. It appears the dumbing down of society and the systematic removal of critical thinking skills is working................because the majority fail to see what lays ahead and just spout the same propoganda that is fed to the media for dispersal to the general public who no longer capable of deep thinking and who also do not seem to give a damn about anything until it affects them personally.

Wake up for gods sake!!


Last edited by Makwa on Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:07 pm 
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Makwa, my sentiments exactly!!! I support the idea of taking to the streets to protest against corruption in FDA and USDA, and to prosecute the Monsanto criminals for murders of innocent people and animals. Oh, and include posecution of the criminals at FDA and USDA too, they are all Monsanto ex-advisers anyway. Who's with me? :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 1:06 am 
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Acolyte wrote:
That's unproven - it's a theory that has yet to find solid evidence, and genetic diversity (29 million genes and 50 thousand genetic families suggest the theory has gaping holes in it.

Thats because we havent mapped everything and we havenet discovered what every chromosome does. It's the best evidence of evolution.

Acolyte wrote:
XSlayerALE wrote:
Genetic code will not allow plant DNA to be spliced into any animal DNA

This is just plain wrong. They are splicing fish genes into fruits, and trying all kinds of animal genes into plants. There is nothing that will prevent any type of gene manipulation in the code.

Enlighten me me then. Genetic engineering experiments come under finding out what traits it eliminates, adds or tract. I havent found any research where they splice plant chromosome into animals (or vice versa). It wont be the first time that you would have educated me.

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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 3:48 pm 
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Problem with GM crops is that they are sterile. Research has been made in Moscow showing that mice fed GM soy been became sterile in the third generation. Shamans now claim that some new GM food will make people sterile in first generation. Looks like GM is more of a biological weapon that could be programmed to hit specific ethnic groups.

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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 7:22 pm 
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It’s a slipperly slope for sure….I guess there is good side and bad side to most things. The facts are it’s expensive to study, so companies that invest have a lot of money tied up….it’s not well regulated and this leads to companies pushing things out to the consumer very quickly to get their money back and that’s obviously not a good thing.

If GMOs were done properly that would mean we could breed plants in a shorter time and they would be more effective. We could feed more people. We’ve been fooling around with breeding plants for thousands of years. Some plants we can save through this type of study and some we may destroy.

We need tougher regulations.

If controlling our population was on the agenda there are so many ways to do that. If you were faced with do or die for the planet, what would you choose. If it was your own child, would you cut off his leg to save the rest of him even though it may be considered harsh in the beginning?

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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 8:43 pm 
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XSlayerALE wrote:
Enlighten me me then. Genetic engineering experiments come under finding out what traits it eliminates, adds or tract. I havent found any research where they splice plant chromosome into animals (or vice versa). It wont be the first time that you would have educated me.


Excellent article on gmo
Quote:
A Tomato Fish Or A Fish Tomato?

In the 1970's scientists discovered a way to artificially alter or transfer genes from one organism to another. Genes are made of DNA and contain the instructions by which cells produce proteins. These proteins dictate a cell's function in the specific organism. A flounder, for example survives in the cold. Scientists could now take genes from a fish and insert them into a tomato. Why? They wanted to create a tomato that would be more frost resistant.

....Biotechnology is not very precise. During the genetic manipulation process, the location where a gene is inserted into an organism's genetic code is uncontrollable. Also a stable expression of the gene into the new genetically engineered organism is not guaranteed. This is why when scientists tried to clone an animal; they ended up with hundreds of deformities and other mutations before they finally succeeded. Scientists may be able to identify a specific gene, but do they understand the workings of its environment? This may be on a micro scale, but it relates to the concerns on a macro scale as well.

Do we understand all of the possible effects of releasing these altered organisms into our delicate environment and eco-systems? Questions of contamination, genetic erosion, enhanced weed problems, and the reduction or extinction of wild plant and animal populations fill pages and pages of environmental and food advocate websites. Can we predict how GMOs and their offspring will evolve?

Full article: http://www.geneticengineering.net/atoma ... tomato.htm


Quote:
New Research Finds That Roundup Ready GMO Crops May Cause Animal Miscarriages


Here's another reason the recent approval of GMO alfalfa and sugar beets was a bad idea: researchers claim that Roundup Ready GE crops contain an organism, completely unknown until now, that has been shown to cause miscarriages in farm animals.

The new organism was detected only after researchers observed it using a 36,000X microscope. It is about the size of a virus. The scary part: it can reproduce, and possesses the rare ability to cause disease in both plants and animals.

The research was performed by Professor Don M. Huber of Purdue University. Huber is also a coordinator for the USDA National Plant Disease Recovery System. He penned an open letter to Agriculture Secretary Tom Vilsack outlining the dangers of this organism, how it was discovered, and his recommendation that a moratorium on the sale and planting of Roundup Ready crops be put in place immediately. He states:

"In summary, because of the high titer of this new animal pathogen in Roundup Ready crops, and its association with plant and animal diseases that are reaching epidemic proportions, we request USDA's participation in a multi-agency investigation, and an immediate moratorium on the deregulation of RR crops until the causal/predisposing relationship with glyphosate and/or RR plants can be ruled out as a threat to crop and animal production and human health.
It is urgent to examine whether the side-effects of glyphosate use may have facilitated the growth of this pathogen, or allowed it to cause greater harm to weakened plant and animal hosts. It is well-documented that glyphosate promotes soil pathogens and is already implicated with the increase of more than 40 plant diseases..."

A new organism, able to reproduce and cause disease in both plants and animals. If it's able to cause infertility and miscarriage in the farm animals that are in contact with it, one can only wonder: what is it doing to us?

Full article: http://www.treehugger.com/files/2011/02 ... riages.php

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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 9:07 pm 
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I don't think I would have a problem with GMO products if I was not aware the corporations behind these things are ruthless, undercutting, and unethical. There are a great number of veggies in our groceries that all have a wild mustard as a common ancestor. The way we know wheat is the result of a significant genetic mutation from the wild types. We have made countless other tweaks to the genetics of plants in our modern labs for quite a few decades now, I agree with XSlayer, but I wouldn't want to support some of the companies that provide the GMO seeds.

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 Post subject: Re: Genetically Modified Food
PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 9:13 pm 
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There's a ginormous difference between using the natural transport mechanisms of a species to alter the expression of genes already there and going in with a chainsaw and superglue and a blindfold and jabbing in foreign genes in random places.

And wheat appears to have been modified by experts, thousands of years ago. Same with corn and rice.

I have no objections to them finding out how to do things - there are many potential benefits to such work, but these people are like elephants trying to thread a needle, and who then send the results out to destroy natural crops and species before we have any idea of the potential for disaster. When there is no natural diversity left, and we discover that we're killing off our animals, where do we find seed stock to return to a viable food source?


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